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	<title>Comments on: Does union power still frighten voters?</title>
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	<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/</link>
	<description>Observations from Carlton&#039;s Lone Classical Liberal</description>
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		<title>By: Club Troppo &#187; Tuesday's Missing Link</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7750</link>
		<dc:creator>Club Troppo &#187; Tuesday's Missing Link</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Jun 2007 07:32:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7750</guid>
		<description>[...] union power still frighten voters? Andrew Norton and Mark Bahnisch ponder. 11.  KP: You&#8217;d reckon it must be showing up as such in Coalition [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] union power still frighten voters? Andrew Norton and Mark Bahnisch ponder. 11.  KP: You&#8217;d reckon it must be showing up as such in Coalition [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Argy</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7755</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Argy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jun 2007 05:58:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7755</guid>
		<description>Thanks Andrew.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Andrew.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Norton</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7753</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Norton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jun 2007 05:50:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7753</guid>
		<description>Fred - I am not aware of this question being asked. The only time I am aware of the issue appearing is in the Australian National Political Attitudes surveys of the late 1960s and 1979, which included open-ended questions about likes and dislikes of the major parties. About 5% nominated business influence for a reason for not liking the Liberals. Given the reliance on stereotypes in public opinion, I am sure it would be much higher if a direct question was asked.

There is a regular question on big business power generally. In every survey I am aware of, going back to the 1960s, a majority have thought that big business has too much power, with an upward trend (also recorded in the 2005 article linked to above).

One hypothesis that could be worth exploring is whether there is a counter-cyclical component to opinion on these matters; that when Labor is in office people are inclined to assume that unions have too much power, and when the Coalition is in office people are inclined to assume that business has too much power.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fred &#8211; I am not aware of this question being asked. The only time I am aware of the issue appearing is in the Australian National Political Attitudes surveys of the late 1960s and 1979, which included open-ended questions about likes and dislikes of the major parties. About 5% nominated business influence for a reason for not liking the Liberals. Given the reliance on stereotypes in public opinion, I am sure it would be much higher if a direct question was asked.</p>
<p>There is a regular question on big business power generally. In every survey I am aware of, going back to the 1960s, a majority have thought that big business has too much power, with an upward trend (also recorded in the 2005 article linked to above).</p>
<p>One hypothesis that could be worth exploring is whether there is a counter-cyclical component to opinion on these matters; that when Labor is in office people are inclined to assume that unions have too much power, and when the Coalition is in office people are inclined to assume that business has too much power.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Argy</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7756</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Argy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jun 2007 03:38:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7756</guid>
		<description>Andrew, I agree that although there is diminishing hostility to unions, there is still some political mileage for the Howard Government on the double issue - too much power and too much influence on the ALP.

But you are such a fund of knowledge on polling, Andrew, you might be able to answer this question. Have Australians been asked:  does business (or big business) have too much power and too much influence on the Liberal Party? If there is such information for a long period, is there a trend to more or less hostility?

I ask this question because, although it is much more dangerous for the ALP to imply sinister business influence, two can play at the same game.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Andrew, I agree that although there is diminishing hostility to unions, there is still some political mileage for the Howard Government on the double issue &#8211; too much power and too much influence on the ALP.</p>
<p>But you are such a fund of knowledge on polling, Andrew, you might be able to answer this question. Have Australians been asked:  does business (or big business) have too much power and too much influence on the Liberal Party? If there is such information for a long period, is there a trend to more or less hostility?</p>
<p>I ask this question because, although it is much more dangerous for the ALP to imply sinister business influence, two can play at the same game.</p>
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		<title>By: Panadawn</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7757</link>
		<dc:creator>Panadawn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jun 2007 02:56:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7757</guid>
		<description>That footage I saw on the 7.30 Report the other night of Reynolds walking along a footpath saying &quot;Faaark ooorf.&quot; to the cameras is priceless, heh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That footage I saw on the 7.30 Report the other night of Reynolds walking along a footpath saying &#8220;Faaark ooorf.&#8221; to the cameras is priceless, heh.</p>
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		<title>By: Leopold</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7758</link>
		<dc:creator>Leopold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Jun 2007 02:03:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7758</guid>
		<description>Start with Combet&#039;s &#039;we should run this country&#039; line, THEN show Mighell, Reynolds etc.

Finish with scary voice: &#039;Greg Combet is Labor candidate for the seat of Charlton. Do YOU think unions should run this country?&#039;

It&#039;ll be ugly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Start with Combet&#8217;s &#8216;we should run this country&#8217; line, THEN show Mighell, Reynolds etc.</p>
<p>Finish with scary voice: &#8216;Greg Combet is Labor candidate for the seat of Charlton. Do YOU think unions should run this country?&#8217;</p>
<p>It&#8217;ll be ugly.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Norton</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7752</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Norton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 22:51:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7752</guid>
		<description>Mark - The 1990 to 2004 data is some pollster same question, the 1987 data is same pollster and the same basic question with slightly different wording. It&#039;s good enough for a graph in which nothing turns, unlike an election, on minor differences. I have similar questions and similar answers from Saulwick as well for the earlier time period, which gives me confidence that the results are robust.

That Rudd result from Nielsen is similar to the AES 2004 in agreeing that unions would have too much power, 38%/41%. The difference occurs on the other side of the result. In 2007,  53% disagree and in 2004 28% disagree. The similar agree result could be rusted-on union haters who will vote Liberal anyway, and the increase in disagreeing could be people confident that Rudd would not take us back to the 1970s or 1980s. On the other hand, it could be that the AES is a mail-out survey with a printed option &#039;neither agree nor disagree&#039; (31% in 2004), while Nielsen is a phone survey which did not give such an option but recorded a &#039;don&#039;t know&#039; from those who were unable to give an answer or refused to commit to one option or the other.

This is why I like multiple pollsters exploring the same issue in slightly different ways, to get a feel for what role the survey itself is playing in shaping the results.

&#039;Union sympathy&#039; was just my way of trying to avoid word repetition; the real issues are what the questions ask, about union power and whether respondents favour their regulation. A voter could have personal sympathy for a fading union movement without supporting political measures to revive it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark &#8211; The 1990 to 2004 data is some pollster same question, the 1987 data is same pollster and the same basic question with slightly different wording. It&#8217;s good enough for a graph in which nothing turns, unlike an election, on minor differences. I have similar questions and similar answers from Saulwick as well for the earlier time period, which gives me confidence that the results are robust.</p>
<p>That Rudd result from Nielsen is similar to the AES 2004 in agreeing that unions would have too much power, 38%/41%. The difference occurs on the other side of the result. In 2007,  53% disagree and in 2004 28% disagree. The similar agree result could be rusted-on union haters who will vote Liberal anyway, and the increase in disagreeing could be people confident that Rudd would not take us back to the 1970s or 1980s. On the other hand, it could be that the AES is a mail-out survey with a printed option &#8216;neither agree nor disagree&#8217; (31% in 2004), while Nielsen is a phone survey which did not give such an option but recorded a &#8216;don&#8217;t know&#8217; from those who were unable to give an answer or refused to commit to one option or the other.</p>
<p>This is why I like multiple pollsters exploring the same issue in slightly different ways, to get a feel for what role the survey itself is playing in shaping the results.</p>
<p>&#8216;Union sympathy&#8217; was just my way of trying to avoid word repetition; the real issues are what the questions ask, about union power and whether respondents favour their regulation. A voter could have personal sympathy for a fading union movement without supporting political measures to revive it.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Bahnisch</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7754</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Bahnisch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:11:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7754</guid>
		<description>Also, again being pedantic, the &quot;too much power&quot; question is really a proxy for union sympathy. It&#039;s not measuring quite the same thing.

My attention has been drawn to a question in Nielsen recently which probably gives us the best info to go on for how things might play out this year:

&lt;blockquote&gt;the response to the question about unions having too much power under a Rudd government cited at the start of this piece was: agree 38 per cent, disagree 53 per cent, don&#039;t know 9 per cent.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

http://www.theage.com.au/news/opinion/trust-v-economics/2007/06/15/1181414545978.html?page=3</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, again being pedantic, the &#8220;too much power&#8221; question is really a proxy for union sympathy. It&#8217;s not measuring quite the same thing.</p>
<p>My attention has been drawn to a question in Nielsen recently which probably gives us the best info to go on for how things might play out this year:</p>
<blockquote><p>the response to the question about unions having too much power under a Rudd government cited at the start of this piece was: agree 38 per cent, disagree 53 per cent, don&#8217;t know 9 per cent.</p></blockquote>
<p><a href="http://www.theage.com.au/news/opinion/trust-v-economics/2007/06/15/1181414545978.html?page=3" rel="nofollow">http://www.theage.com.au/news/opinion/trust-v-economics/2007/06/15/1181414545978.html?page=3</a></p>
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		<title>By: Mark Bahnisch</title>
		<link>http://andrewnorton.info/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/comment-page-1/#comment-7751</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Bahnisch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 13:50:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://andrewnorton.info/blog/2007/06/15/does-union-power-still-frighten-voters/#comment-7751</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Andrew, I couldn&#039;t find the AES data. I only had about an hour or two to research the piece! Strictly speaking the other surveys you cite aren&#039;t time series, because they&#039;re not conducted by the same organisations using the same questions and comparable samples.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Andrew, I couldn&#8217;t find the AES data. I only had about an hour or two to research the piece! Strictly speaking the other surveys you cite aren&#8217;t time series, because they&#8217;re not conducted by the same organisations using the same questions and comparable samples.</p>
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